- 3/29/2012 Phone meeting to discuss unblinding:
- Local participants: Kent Paschke, Diancheng Wang, Xiaochao Zheng;
- Remote participants: Kai Pan, Krishna Kumar;
- Diancheng gave an update on the radiative corrections and
the transverse asymmetry. These are posted on (the updated version of)
his March 15 slides:
- Radiative corrections update:
- Slide 5 shows the updated uncertainty estimate for
the radiative corrections, using the scheme we agreed on the 3/22
meeting. The error on radiative correction is 2% for kine #1 and 0.43%
on kine #2.
- Simulations with Misha's table are shown on page 33 for the resonance
data and page 35 for the DIS data. They have the same agreement with
resonance data as Lee&Tao+Toy model, but has a 1% difference from
Lee&Tao+Toy model for the DIS corrections (compare slides 34 with
35). This indicates that the radiative correction error on kine #1 is
large, as expected.
- We discussed different schemes of applying the radiative correction and agreed on these iteration procedure (PDF) for unblinding.
- Transverse asymmetries have been updated, see slide #36-37:
- Measured AT are shown. At this stage there is still
discrepancy between Kai and Diancheng's analysis, but they will
straighten this out.
- The error due to AT should be estimated using the 24.15ppm (for kine #1) and 44.91 ppm (for kine #2).
- The average out-of-plane angle of our DAQ is very
small (slides 38 and 39). Therefore the first term in "correction to
Ad" on slide #36 can be neglected.
- Xiaochao reported on the 2C2u-C2d vs beta_HT correlations, see elog #141
- The actual kinematics of our measurement is summarized below. These are now used in the calculation shown here;
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Kine #1
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Kine #2 (L, R combined)
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Kine #2 (Left arm only)
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Kine #2 (Right arm only)
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Central
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Q2=1.121, xbj=0.248
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Q2=1.925, xbj=0.298
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Actual
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Q2=1.085, xbj=0.241
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Q2=1.901, xbj=0.2947
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Q2=1.886, xbj=0.2926
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Q2-1.907, xbj=0.2956
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- Correlation ellipses are shown for different blinding factors and are explained in this log entry;
- Scroll down to Attachment 15 (the spreadsheet), one
column of APV based on "no nuclear structure, no PDF" is shown. For
example, "on the sheet named "SFfits-1.901", column N is using the PDG
Eq.(10.21). The results of column N are to be compared with column H
(CJ fit, our best fit) and T (MSTW2008 NLO F2 based with Christy R, the
one we will be using for unblinding). The very small difference shows
that we are not affected at all by the structure functions (and their
uncertainties). A 1% uncertainty due to structure functions can be
quoted and is very generous.
- Attachements 16 and 17 shows some plots I got from
Wally on the resonance APV model and how well our data can constrain
them. This is a work in progress by Wally. The goal is to contrain the
background (box diagram) correction to Qweak. It's remarkable how much
our Delta result disagree with the model, and how well our other
resonance data agree with it.
- Kai reported his study on the systematic uncertainties, in elog #142. A similar table is shown on slide 7 of Diancheng's March 15 talk.
- To dos in preparation for unblinding:
- Iteration scheme for radiative corrections - Diancheng, Xiaochao;
- Xiaochao will get C1,2 for the actual Q2 from J. Erler, although the values we have now (central Q2) are probably good enough.
- finalizing transverse and pion asymmetries, and their corrections to our measurement - Diancheng, Kai;
- finalize corrections due to pion asymmetry and/or dilution - Diancheng, Kai.
- Summarize all corrections and their uncertainties in a pretty table - Diancheng, Kai.
- To dos that are needed for the publication, but can be done after the unblinding (partial):
- Radiative and PID corrections to resonance asymmetry results (check all other corrections if not final);
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- 3/22/2012 Phone meeting to discuss unblinding:
- Local participants: Kent Paschke, Diancheng Wang, Nilanga Liyanage, Xiaochao Zheng;
- Remote participants: Kai Pan, Krishna Kumar, Dave Armstrong, Paul Reimer, Robert Michaels, Zhiwen Zhao
- Xiaochao's report (slides, spreadsheet on PDF calculation, and spreadsheet on extracted C2q as posted elog #138), comments and to-dos:
- KK: we see a 0.5% difference between different PDF
fits. What is the size of the structure function effect? And how does
this 0.5% compare to the s.f. effect? - Xiaochao will come up
with some sort of "no-structure expression" for Ad and answer this
question;
- KK: What is the error on beta_HT if we use the Q2=1.1
point alone? XZ's quick answer is +/-0.014, using 0.03 times
(1-x)^3*Q^2 where 0.03 is the statistical error of the Q2=1.1 point.
But we will check this.
- We concluded at the meeting that we will use the
"1-parameter" fit to extract C2q from the Q2=1.9 GeV2 point only. We
will publish a correlation plot (but not numerical values) for the
extracted C2q vs. beta_HT from the 2-parameter fit. Xiaochao will work
on such plot.
- We concluded at the meeting that using neutrino data's
HT results on our calculated F3gammaZ term is informational, but we
will not do it because there is no reason to a) trust the neutrino data
or its application to our case; and b) apply a HT term extracted from
the structure function to the ratio of structure functions
(asymmetries).
- Will redo all these practice at the real Q2. All results shown were using the central Q2 and x.
- Kai's report (slides as posted elog #139), comments and to-dos:
- PID correction for day 21 and 34 have been re-worked (slide 2);
- So
far only applied PID corrections to DIS production runs. We need to do
this for all production data (resonance and transverse). See general
to-do below
- Agree with Diancheng on the run list;
- Short runs (as few as 800 pairs) should be included as long as they are good runs;
- Found a sizable difference in kine #1 asymmetry using
different BCM pedestal value (slide #1). We concluded at the meeting
that this can only be caused by the beam current cut being too
high/tight. We should apply different current cuts to different run
periods, depending on the nominal beam current used during that period.
Kine #1 for example had quite some runs taken at 70 uA rather than
100uA. Once we use a lower current cut, we should not see the bcm
pedestal to influence the asymmetry so much.
- Compton tune runs are divided into "beam tune" and
"laser tune" runs. We concluded "beam tune" should be rejected but
"laser tune" should be included in the final analysis (already applied
to the results shown on slide #1).
- To do for Kai: continue with master macro and work out all systematic corrections and uncertainties.
- Diancheng: does not have slides today but have gone
through A-C from the 3/15 minutes. We discussed about radiative
correction (was not clear on 3/15) and concluded:
- We do not scale the model in the Delta resonance and quote a 2-sigma error on the Delta model;
- RES#5 and #7 were centered around W=1.8 GeV(but
different Q2) and data agree with model almost perfectly. We do
not scale the model. We will combine the statistical error of RES#5 and
#7 data (take the relative error and add the inverse in quadrature?)
and used the combined statistical error as our error on the toy model
for W~1.8 GeV.
- RES#4 was centered around W=1.5 GeV and data had a ~1.1
sigma discrepancy with the toy model. We will not scale the toy model,
and will quote a 1.1 sigma error on the toy model in this W region. One
reason for not scaling the model is because we do not scale RES#3, 5
and 7 and we do not feel comfortable with scaling the model only in the
2nd resonance range (and not the 1st or the 3rd).
- We will apply different error bars to the resonance
model as described above. Diancheng will check the W spectrum of RES#3
through #7 and come up with the W range that should be used for
different error bars.
- We discussed about transverse asymmetry at the end of the meeting. In the equation shown on slide #34 of Diancheng's talk on 3/15,
AT refers to the "absolute" beam transverse asymmetry. But our measured
transverse asymmetry already has the k(cross)k' in and thus already
have the sin(theta0) factor. So this whole equation should be divided
by sin(theta0) if AT refers to the measured transverse asymmetry. To
estimate the final uncertainty due to AT:
- Diancheng will use HAMC to calculate the
acceptance/cross section-averaged theta_tr; To estimate the
uncertainty, one can cut off 10% of the acceptance on the edge and see
how that affect the extracted theta_tr;
- Nilanga will also help to estimate the error on theta_tr;
- AT analysis should be finalized, but see general to-do list below.
- Other general to do:
- all corrections we have applied to DIS data should be applied to Resonance data as well. This includes PID corrections.
- Kai and Diancheng will work on the asymmetry analysis
of all other kinematics and triggers, including: Transverse asymmetry,
resonances, and pion asymmetries. We should have AT and resonance
results ready by the time of unblinding. Pion asymmetries are not part
of the unblinding but will be published, so they should be finalized
also around the time of unblinding.
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- 3/15/2012 Phone meeting to discuss unblinding:
- Local participants: Kent Paschke, Diancheng Wang, Nilanga Liyanage, Xiaochao Zheng;
- Remote participants: Kai Pan, Krishna Kumar, Dave Armstrong, Paul Reimer, Robert Michaels, Zhiwen Zhao
- Kai's report (slides as posted elog #137) and comments
- PID correction for day 21 should be re-worked: Is day 21 RES#7?
- PID
correction for day 34 should be re-worked: We did not have VDC on runs
for day 34, but should not use interpolation of PID efficiencies
between days 32 and 37 (since day #37 was 4-pass resonance runs). If
day 34 was the end of kine #2, should use the average of the previous
couple of days.
- Error on the deadtime correction does not seem right;
- will continue working on the master macro.
- Diancheng's report: (slides as posted elog #136)
- slide
#2: for uncertainties related to BCM asymmetry, we know from HAPPEX-III
that nonlinearity is controlled to 2%. We can use 3%, and the
uncertainty would be 3% of the BCM asymmetry (1.32ppm). Also need to:
- work out this number separately for kine #1 and #2;
- check if there were any run with significantly larger BCM asymmetry, such as >100ppm?
- slide
#2: for uncertainties related to beam modulation, need to use the
measured slope (5ppb/nm) times the grand average (40nm), giving 200pb
for the uncertainty on our measurement. But these two numbers were the
overall performance of kine #1 and #2. Need to
- work out these numbers separately for kine #1 and #2;
- slide #3: for beam polarization, KK suggested the following exercises:
- take
the statistical-weighted average of Moller (=local correction), compare
to an overall average of Moller (overall = straight line fit);
- take
the statistical-weighted average of Compton (=local correction),
compare to an overall average of Compton (overall = straight line fit);
- construct a polynomial fit to Compton and do local correction, figure out the statistical-weighted average;
- Compare all above. The difference should be much smaller than the 2% systematic uncertainty;
- For
month #2, since we have both Compton and Moller, will combine these
two. The overal systematic uncertainty would be 2% and 1.9% divided
down (based on the central limit theorem), giving 1.4%.
- On radiative corrections (slides #5, #31-33):
- D.A.
and K.K. commented that maybe we do not want to scale the Delta model
since Delta is well known. We can quote a 2-sigma error on the Delta
model;
- We can scale the toy model or Misha's calculation based
on our RES#4 result, which shows a slightly >1 sigma discrepancy
from the model. Are we going to scale the model for W~1.5 GeV???
- kine#1
has about 26% events from the resonance region. Using a 9-10% error
(based on our RES#4, 5 and 7 data), this will cause a 2.6% error on our
kine#1 asymmetry.
- kine#2 has only 3.6% events from the resonance region so the error due to rad corr will be much smaller (good!).
- Other general to do: Kai and Diancheng still need to finalize a common run list and cross check asymmetries;
- Xiaochao will figure out how to use the kine#1 data: simultaneous fit of C2 and HT using both kine #1 and #2, or else?
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- 3/02/2012
(Xiaochao) I am very behind on logging the meeting minutes so below is
just a summary of what happened in the past month, what was reported
today, a to do list for the next 2 weeks, and a brief plan for the
phone meeting on March 15.
- We will have a phone meeting at 9-11am on Thursday, March 15, to discuss where we are on the PVDIS unblinding. The plan is:
- Diancheng
and Kai will each provide slides to summarize the procedure of the
mastermacro and summary of all systematic corrections that go into the
macro. The presentations will be much like what we had at the Jan. 6th
collaboration meeting;
- Diancheng
and Kai will each show their own version of the master macro. We will
have screen-sharing to show how the macros work and run;
- We will raise any unanswered question about the analysis and answer any question people may have;
- In the slight chance that we do not spot serious problems, we will talk about unblinding.
- To do for the next two weeks:
- Diancheng and Kai will work on the runlist, reach an agreement and provide final asymmetry results;
- Kai will work on his own version of master macro. (Diancheng already
has his own version but will work further on all final corrections);
- Kai will understand HAMC and cross-check Diancheng's work;
- Diancheng will use RES#3 results to figure out an overall scaling
correction factor to Harry Lee's table (presumably the correction is
the same for Misha's table as well). Apply this correction to Harry's
Lee's table , or to Misha's table but on the Delta (1232) only, then
run radiative correction again and post updated results;
- Diancheng will send a tar-ball of his HAMC code to Bob for a cross-checking;
- Diancheng will solidify the concept of different Q2's. Compare the simulated Q2 to the measured
value. - Diancheng will also email Xiaochao (as early as possible) the Q2 and x
values at which we want to publish the data. Xiaochao will use these
(instead of the central settings) to calculate C2q.
- For beam polarization correction we will adopt PREX and HAPPEXIII's method (Bob):
- for the 1st month when Compton was not available we will use Moller for a time-based run by run correction;
- for the 2nd month when both Compton and Moller were available we will
take the average of the two (weighted by the total uncertainty of each
polarimetry) for atime-based run by run correction. The error of the correction will be the larger of Compton and Moller.
- Today we focused on the error of HAMC simulation, see log 133 and log 134.
The main method is to run HAMC with a certain number of trials several
times but with different random seeds. The spread in the resulting
asymmetry should give us an idea of how big the "statistical"
uncertainty of HAMC is.
- The ratio spread (RMS)/mean in log 134 is about 0.145% for DIS#1, 20k trials per run, 50 runs.
- The ratio spread (RMS)/mean in log 133 is about 0.089% for DIS#2, 1M trials per run, 100 runs, and about 10% fall within the acceptance.
- Xiaochao
tries to relate the spread of the histogram to the number of trials but
do not find a clear relation. Perhaps there is no math model behind the
two and we can only say the more trials we do, the less spread it is.
- Using
the spread as the error of HAMC we think 1M is good enough. I'd like to
see a spread of much below 0.1%, but since HAMC is used only to apply
relative corrections, the size of the stat. spread is not that
important as long as we run HAMC with fixed random seeds
when calculating radiative, acceptance and PID corrections (this
way any "stat" fluctuation of the simulation might just "cancel
out").
- Run-by-run
PID correction factors are now near complete. The format of the PID
input to HAMC and some results are posted in log 131 and log 132. Diancheng has corresponding tables posted at his "mastermacro directory". These entries are dated and discussed on 2/24:
- We
discussed why the correction is mostly greater than 1.00000 (this means
PID corrections changes the asymmetry only towards one side), but
perhaps this is just the way it is.
- It's not clear if 200k trials is enough for HAMC simulation. This has been studied and reported on 3/2 (see above).
- Change to physics models in HAMC:
- As pointed outby Diancheng, there is a discontinuity (a jump) in A/Q2
using Xiaochao's MSTW2008NNLO code for DIS#2. Xiaochao contacted MSTW
group and found out this is a known "problem" of their NNLO PDF fits:
The PDFs have a discontinuity at the charm quark mass squared. Some plots calculated by us are posted in log 130.
Suggestions were provided by Graeme Watt, see his email.
- Now
we have changed to using the fixed 3-flavor MSTW fit and in fact this
has changed the sign of acceptance correction for Q2=1.9. For the
central Q2 setting, however, the 3-flavor PDFs are identical to
5-flavor values because our central Q2 (1.925) is below the charm mass
sq of MSTW2008.
- Xiaochao continued the PDF and structure function study. Updates are posted in log 97. A snapshot is shown below:
- Using running value of alpha(EM);
- MSTW2008 routine does provide R at LO, NLO and N2LO level. R values are summarized in the spreadsheet of this log;
- The
physics model in HAMC is using a running value of s2w (0.235) and tree
level definition of C1,2q. Xiaochao got the updated EW-corrected C1,2
values and the latest s2w at Z-pole from J.Erler. In the spreadsheet a
simple scaling of 2C1u-C1d and 2C2u-C2d is done to the F1gz and F3gz
contributions of the asymmetry.
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- 1/20/2012, Present: Kent, Xiaochao, Diancheng, Bob (phone), Paul (phone)
- Xiaochao updated on how to calculate the expected APV:
- Updated R using Hall C (Christy's) fit. References are 1201.0576, 0712.3731, nucl-ex/0410027 (has formula for F2,R->F1), and nucl-ex/0611023. The value is between R1998 and R.Petti's calculations (so we are good);
- Discussed the runnings of constants with Jens Erler:
- Only sin2theta_W and alpha(EM) run, GFermi does not.Updated slides on Running of constants: PDF;
- EW
corrections to Ciq: should use the Ciq definition as in Table 10.2 of
PDG2011 with the s2w value in the MSbar scheme at the Z-pole. In other
words, no need to run s2w if we apply EW corrections to Ciq. Jens
provided the values for kappas and lambdas at Q2=1.9.
- Jens
pointed out there is a 1% difference between the alpha (on-shell or
effective) and the alpha(MSbar). For consistency we should use the
MSbar scheme throughout. For example, E158 used the on shell alpha(Q2)
but then applied an additional QED correction factor of 1.01+/-0.01.
- Kent pointed out we need to be careful with the scheme used in PDF and struct. func fits as well.
- Todo:
- Discuss with Zein-Eddine on radiative corrections
- Test MSTW structure function routine and see if it provides R (code is here)
- Use
F2's in CJ fit instead of F1's, combine with the best R to get F2 (CJ
fit does not provide reliable values for R - no fit to R data!);
- Goal:
Look for a "generic" code to calculate struct functions from PDFs in
the NLO or higher order, modify Ciq in the code to study how to extract
results from our APV data.
- Diancheng reported he is working on the master macro and discussed the following two topics:
- How to combine the systematic error of run-by-run corrections (such as Compton)?
- Should
combine adjacent Compton runs anyway so each "time window" has a
reasonable Compton stat error. If treated this way, no need to
"combine" Compton stat error on a run-to-run basis.
- Systematic
error of each Compton "window" should be weighted by the error of the
parity (asymmetry) measurements from the same time window.
- Will try all 4 methods in the asymmetry analysis but how to check the results?
- (Xiaochao): Can derive the difference between methods on paper;
- Can apply a tight current cut and all 4 methods should give identical results;
- (Kent):
Can weight the asymmetry of each pair based on the width of that pair.
If can do this numerically or using ROOT, should yield the same results
as the run-wise method.
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- 01/13/2012 Present: Xiaochao, Diancheng (phone), Kai, Bob (phone)
- Xiaochao
- looked into the Q2 running of all constants and couplings in the APV formula
- see below discussions on 1/9, 1/10 and 1/13(theory)
- Diancheng: updated radiative correction slides.
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- 1/13/2012 (theory followup):
- XZ
compared CJ (NLO) with CTEQ6L+QPM and MSTW2008LO+QPM and found
comparable results on the F1 vs. F3 contributions to APV (see
spreadsheet in log 97);
- Question: If
we use NLO PDFs in constructing the structure functions F1gz and F3gz,
what R to use in Y1 and Y3 to calculate APV? Anwer from WM:
- Since CTEQ fits did not include any data on FL (R), should use the phenomenology value (R1998 or Christy's fit).
- MSTW does include cross sections but don't know if they provide results on the corresponding QCD orders of R.
- Since
CJ fit does not provide the correct value of R, should use F2g and
F2gz, then use phenomenology R to get the F1g and F1gz. This will not
affect the F1gz/F1g contribution to APV, but will affect the F3gz/F1g
term.
- For sin2W, should use the value at our Q2 (1.925GeV2). The CJ code has the running subroutine that we can "borrow".
- WM: Should try the ABKM PDF fits (published 2010) since they include FL.
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- 01/10/2012: Xiaochao had a phone meeting with H. Lee and M. Gorschtyen:
- Preparation:
- H.L.:
- Recap of the calculation:
- The
model includes both W1,W3 terms. All parameters used in the model were
determined from previous work on e-pi productions or neutrino pion
productions [neutrino analysis published in PRC67,065201(2003)];
- Model includes Delta(1232) as well as background. At some places the background may contribute more than the Delta itself;
- Should not be used above W=1.4 GeV. Above 1.4 GeV the calculation only gives background, not higher resonances.
- Need to see proton results from G0 to confirm the proton model works well (PAVI11 G0 slides sent at 1pm - Xiaochao);
- Has been waiting for this data for 10 years.
- The
2 sigma discrepancy may motivate a full deuteron calculation. Expect
the full calculation shows smaller asymmetry than simply adding p+n.
Full calculation will take min 1, max 2 years. Will talk to
collaborators about this.
- M.G.:
- Recap of the model:
- The
model includes all 7 resonances from Delta to F37 (1915). Above W=2 is
all background extension. Inputs are from PDG resonance data (proton
and neutron/deuteron separate). HL commented the PDG resonance
strengths are not well determined, for all resonances.
- The
model is completely fixed at Q2=0. Certain uncertainties (~20%?) arises
at low Q2, and more at higher Q2. For the particular calculations sent
to PVDIS, used LT AD calculation to fix the high Q2 limit.
- The
model is based on vector meson dominance, where the virtual photon
fluctuates into vector mesons, which interact with the proton. This is
used to determine the isospin structure of the backgrounds, which are
not calculable otherwise.
- Can in principle include the W3 (gammaZ) term, but question how big the contribution is.
- The table provides W>2 calculations, but can't say whether it is more reliable than direct DIS calculation.
- The
0 asymmetries in the table should only come from kinematically
impossible regions, so do not understand why only covers 44% of the
RES#3 simulation.
- Later addition by Diancheng: still looking into the table coverage to trace down the Misha table problem.
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- 01/09/2012: Xiaochao met Wally Melnitchouk and Alberto Accardi.
- Inquire
what causes the big difference between Rgamma calculated by Wally and
those by R. Petti (see slides 11-12 of Xiaochao's talk on 1/6)
- WM's
is NLO(+TMC), no fitting to data. RP's is NNLO with fit to data. Could
ask RP the relative NLO vs. NNLO composition of his results for a more
direct comparison (followup: email sent to RP on 1/10).
- WM: do not plan to do NNLO for R
anytime soon because it's too complicated. "What we are working on now"
is a global analysis (jet+DIS data) of FL.
- Since RP's includes
fitting to data while WM's calculation miss data by a factor of 4, will
use RP's vs. R1998 to study the effect on APV.
- What's the difference between CTEQ and CTEQ-JLab (CJ) fits:
- Answer (slide 13 of AA's talk
on 1/6): 1) different data input (CTEQ dominated by high energy, CJ
includes low Q2 and low W); 2) CJ includes higher twists and TMC
(that's why CTEQ had to cut out low Q2/low W data);
- Latest CJ fit was published in PRD84:014008,2011 or arXiv:1102.3686[hep-ph]. Direct comparison of the CJ and the corresponding CTEQ fit results can be found in "the first paper": PRD 81, 034016 (2010) or arXiv:0911.2254[hep-ph].
- Concerning
the deuteron: nCTEQ (NNLO) used A-dependence in their fitting
functions, and used heavy nuclear data as inputs (from proton to iron);
CJ used only proton and deuteron data and used nuclear models for the
deuteron nuclear correction.
- How much will our 12% measurement on the Delta APV help Qweak?
- WM: don't know the answer right now.
- followup from WM: will have a student in mid Feb to start looking into this. A 10% measurement could be helpful.
- Followup from AA: this directory contains the CJ fit code.
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- 01/06/2012: We had our first collaboration meeting. Click here for talks and meeting minutes.
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